This week, Uğur Canbolat spoke with Prof. Dr. İbrahim Özdemir about "Differences Between Philosophical Counseling and Psychological Counseling" in the interview series titled Tenha Sohbetler.
While psychological counseling is often the first thing that comes to mind when one speaks of counseling, philosophical counseling is now increasingly becoming a topic of discussion. In our previous interview, we discussed the details of philosophical counseling with Prof. Dr. İbrahim Özdemir. In this interview, we aimed to focus more on the differences between them, the current situation in Turkey, and Prof. Dr. Nevzat Tarhan's significant contributions to the field. We are pleased to present this interview, which requires careful reading.
As a philosophy professor, how did you get started with philosophical counseling? What prompted you in this field? What is your experience? Also, who are the people most frequently seeking philosophical counseling?
Although I have been involved in philosophical counseling throughout my life as a philosopher, I professionally started this work right after the earthquake. I tried to help earthquake victims online.
In a short time, the interest shown by our citizens living in different continents such as the United States, Europe, and even Australia surprised me.
What do they ask most frequently?
The most frequently asked questions were existential ones, such as the meaning of life, moral values, death, loneliness, disloyalty, and communication. Answering these types of questions and guiding people toward correct answers in these matters is crucial. Furthermore, it can contribute to their personal development and help them integrate more consciously into the societies they live in. Existential questions are important issues where people question the meaning and value of their own lives. It is especially significant that our citizens living in America and Europe frequently ask such questions.
Your aim of offering philosophical counseling services to our people living in different countries around the world, helping them address these questions, strive to find their own answers, and better understand their inner worlds, is extremely important.
Would you like to say something to your colleagues on this matter?
My philosopher colleagues should not limit themselves solely to the courses they teach at universities or the academic books and articles they write. They need to open communication channels for those experiencing problems to reach them. Philosophical Counseling helps individuals reflect on their personal values, beliefs, and meanings, guiding them on their journey of personal development to lead more conscious and fulfilling lives.
What are the differences between philosophical counseling and psychological or psychiatric therapy?
To understand the differences between philosophical counseling and psychological or psychiatric therapy, let's first examine the fundamental characteristics of both approaches. Then, let's better grasp these differences with examples:
Philosophical counseling is based on philosophical thought and offers philosophical perspectives to individuals to reflect on their lives. When addressing questions, it helps people think critically about their own values, beliefs, and meanings. Therefore, it never regards those with such questions as "patients."
Psychological and psychiatric therapy, although rooted in philosophy like many other sciences, is primarily based on the science of psychology and focuses on individuals' emotional and mental health. Therapists try to help individuals find solutions to their psychological problems. Psychiatrists also use medication therapy if deemed necessary.
So, the direction of Philosophical Counseling is somewhat different, is that right?
Yes. The aim of Philosophical Counseling is to help individuals make their lives more meaningful. This approach addresses existential questions and allows people to deeply understand their values and beliefs. The aim of psychological therapy is to address and find solutions for individuals' emotional and mental problems. Therapists focus on treating psychological issues such as depression, anxiety, and post-traumatic stress disorder. Philosophical counseling is generally carried out through conversation and intellectual exploration, what we call the Socratic method.
Clients engage in in-depth and enjoyable discussions with their counselors as they address philosophical questions and ideas. A philosophical counselor never tries to impose their own philosophical understanding or ideology on the client; they do not direct them toward a specific path. The essence is for the client, with the help of the counselor, to find their own direction and make their own choices.
Is psychological therapy more different than this?
Certainly. Psychological therapy involves a more structured process. Therapists focus on individuals' emotional problems and use specific therapy methods according to the school of psychology or tradition they belong to and were trained in. The approach of a psychologist adhering to Freud, Adler, Jung, or another perspective might differ in the treatment of the same patient.
Professor, could you concretize these differences with examples?
Of course. In Philosophical Counseling, an individual begins to reflect deeply on the meaning of life and addresses these questions with a philosophical counselor. The counselor merely helps the individual question their values and beliefs. They do not ask questions about their past or childhood.
In psychological and psychiatric therapy, on the other hand, the same individual begins to show symptoms of depression. A psychotherapist works with this individual to address the causes of depression and treatment options. To understand this, they may journey into the individual's past.
Could you please elaborate a little more?
For example, a couple is experiencing problems in their relationship. A philosophical counselor helps the couple understand their relationship more deeply. They merely guide them in re-evaluating the relationship based on their own values or universal moral values. If the same couple consistently experiences communication problems, a psychologist helps the couple develop their communication skills and resolve their issues. In conclusion, philosophical counseling and psychological therapy have different goals and approaches. Philosophical counseling helps people deeply question the meaning of their lives, while psychological and psychiatric therapy focuses on emotional and mental health problems. People can choose the approach they prefer based on the problems they face and their needs.
Do you collaborate when necessary?
Yes. In some cases, our psychologist colleagues refer their clients to us, and when we understand that a person seeking our help has a psychological issue, we immediately refer them to a psychologist colleague. We have a very good collaboration in this regard. Some well-known psychologists and psychiatrists I know have started studying philosophy, especially existential philosophy, to better assist those who approach them with existential problems.
What do you say about Existential Therapy?
If you like, let's give examples from Rollo May and Irvin Yalom, two important figures who made significant contributions to the field of existential therapy. Rollo May is a prominent figure in existential therapy. He is the one who brought existential therapy to America. Consequently, he made significant contributions to the development of this type of therapy. Looking at May's main contributions, he primarily conducted important work on how to integrate existential thought into the therapeutic process. He developed a therapeutic approach that helps people discover the meaning and freedom of their lives. I became acquainted with his work through my late professor Bekir Demirkol in the 90s. His book "The Courage to Create" was a revelation for me. Rollo May advocated for emphasizing people's freedom in therapy and proposed that individuals should shape their own lives. Thus, he laid the foundation for an approach that encourages individuals to take responsibility for themselves.
What is the reason you speak of Rollo May with such care?
May is particularly an expert in addressing emotional difficulties such as anxiety and fear. He himself received treatment in a sanatorium for a long time. He closely observed people who, like him, were ill and facing life's challenges. He tried to understand and make sense of their fears and anxieties. Therefore, he focused on understanding the underlying causes of the emotional states he witnessed and equipping individuals with skills to cope with these emotional experiences.
You also make important references to Irvin Yalom...
Yes. Irvin Yalom, a close friend of Rollo May and someone who states he was greatly influenced by him, is a renowned figure in the field of psychotherapy, especially group therapy. Almost all of his books have been translated into our language. They have also been translated into other languages. Therefore, he is an influential name in this field. We analyzed one of his books during my Philosophical Counseling training.
What is Yalom's specialty?
Yalom addresses existential issues in the therapy process. He includes topics such as death, the search for meaning, and freedom in therapy sessions and encourages individuals to reflect on these issues. Thus, he involves the individual in the process. He includes them in reaching the outcome. Yalom consistently emphasizes the importance of empathy and building rapport in the therapeutic process. He believes that a strong therapist-client relationship positively influences therapy outcomes. Both therapists have made significant contributions to existential therapy and helped people address their emotional and psychological problems. These contributions have facilitated the development of existential therapy and made therapeutic processes more effective.
Professor, what is the situation regarding this in Turkey?
It is observed that Prof. Dr. Nevzat Tarhan, the founding rector of Üsküdar Üniversitesi, has also focused on the existential aspect of therapy in recent years. We clearly see this when we look at his books "Mesnevi Terapi" and "Yunus Terapi". We see that the Professor suggests answers to existential questions within the framework of the Sufi wisdom tradition; he encourages his clients to examine these areas from a new perspective. Prof. Dr. Nevzat Tarhan is a significant figure in the field of psychiatry not only in Turkey but also worldwide. I believe that his contributions to existential therapy have given significant momentum to the development of this therapeutic approach in Turkey and internationally. I think the Sufi wisdom tradition, from which he has drawn inspiration since his student years, has helped him immensely. Just as he is well-versed in Freud, Adler, Jung, May, and his other colleagues, he also has a deep understanding of our Sufi wisdom tradition, from Mevlana, Yunus Emre, and Ibn Arabi to Said Nursi. I believe this is what makes the Professor unique.
So, how can you summarize Professor Tarhan's contributions to existential therapy?
First of all, he is one of the pioneers who introduced the existential and holistic therapy approach in Turkey. He helped this type of therapy reach a wider audience in our country and led to an increase in awareness in this field. The Professor did not content himself with the traditional method of writing books and articles. Besides being a prolific writer, he actively used all social media platforms to try and provide answers to people's existential problems. He made important publications on alternative therapy. These publications became significant resources for those who wanted to better understand this therapeutic approach. He practically triggered other colleagues to take action.
Professor Nevzat Tarhan also has hospital applications, I suppose?
Yes. Being the founder of Turkey's first NPİSTANBUL Hastanesi provided Professor Nevzat Tarhan with many opportunities. Alongside clinical therapy, he applied existential therapy in a hospital setting and tried to help patients experiencing psychiatric problems with this therapy. I believe that the Professor's holistic understanding of therapy lies behind NPİSTANBUL Hastanesi becoming a place where people seek healing, from Europe to Gulf countries, in a short time. Of course, the Professor has built a very good team. Their contributions in this regard should also be mentioned.
In short, I believe that Prof. Dr. Nevzat Tarhan is a significant pioneer in the field of holistic and existential therapy in Turkey and has contributed to the development of this type of therapy. This is the reason behind the Professor accepting our offer regarding Critical Thinking and Philosophical Counseling courses. The Professor is aware of the importance of an existential understanding. Indeed, a large portion of those who come to the Professor for treatment have existential problems related to the meaning of life. While existential therapy helps people understand their lives and inner worlds, Professor Tarhan significantly leads in making this therapy accessible to a wider audience in Turkey. Through his work in the field of therapy, he has guided many individuals and contributed to the formation of a scientific framework in this area.
While we're at it, what do you say about Prof. Dr. Nevzat Tarhan's book Mesnevi Terapi?
These books have garnered and continue to garner great interest in Turkey and internationally. In his book "Mesnevi Terapi", the Professor combines Mevlana's unique teachings with psychotherapy. In fact, the famous psychiatrist and philosopher Erich Fromm had stated back in the 1960s that Mevlana would provide answers to our future problems concerning existence and the meaning of life. The book "Mesnevi Terapi", by quoting Mevlana's poems and thoughts, helps people deeply understand their emotional and spiritual experiences. The book explains how Mevlana's teachings on "the disciplining of the self (nafs)" can be integrated into the psychotherapy process.
The nafs (self) is treated as the source of inner conflicts within a person's inner world, and Mevlana's teachings are used to overcome these internal struggles. The book addresses existential topics such as the search for meaning, freedom and responsibility, death, illnesses, loyalty and disloyalty, loneliness, and coping with stress, while also including the fundamental principles and techniques of psychotherapy. The book guides readers on a path to discovering their inner worlds and living their lives in a more meaningful way.
Do you evaluate the book Yunus Terapi in the same context?
The book "Yunus Terapi" is the second important book on this subject, based on the teachings of Yunus Emre. "Yunus Terapi" explains with examples and in an understandable language how to integrate Yunus Emre's thoughts on love and affection into psychotherapy. The book demonstrates how to adapt Yunus Emre's themes such as "reunion with the beloved" and "the fire of love" into the psychotherapy process. Furthermore, the book helps people understand their relationships; and build compassionate, merciful, and loving relationships.
Therefore, both books contribute to people living their lives in a more meaningful and conscious way by integrating the teachings of Mevlana and Yunus Emre, two great masters of our Sufi wisdom tradition, into the psychotherapy process. The fact that these books are read with great interest and appreciated by many readers and therapists in Turkey and worldwide is proof of this.
How does a person know if they need a Philosophical Counselor?
It would be better if we rephrased this question as follows: How can I benefit from a Philosophical Counselor?
As you know, even in the city we have lived in for years, we sometimes have to use a navigator. In a country and city we are visiting, it is almost impossible to find our way without a navigator. On the path of life, too, we need wise people, the guidance of those who have traveled this path before.
Is this what Nevzat Tarhan aims to do with these two books?
Yes, exactly. To benefit from the great experiences of both philosophical history and the Sufi wisdom tradition when making sense of our lives. Of course, you always have the option to find your way without a navigator. Since Socrates, philosophers have tried to enlighten their societies. They provided answers to difficult questions related to existence. There are thinkers who risked their lives for this cause and paid the price with their lives, like Socrates.
Aren't these significant contributions in terms of finding answers to modern human problems?
Yes. Our youth have problems. Parents have problems. We have problems related to our philosophy, faith, race, color, and identity, as well as economic and personal issues. Natural disasters like earthquakes, floods, and droughts cause many problems to crowd our minds. To these, you can add problems caused by people, or rather, "those we consider friends." Disloyalty, selfishness, anxiety, sorrow, grief, sadness... Helplessness in the face of unemployment, illness, and death...
And the worst of all is hopelessness.
Does denying or ignoring these problems help at all?
No. When consistent and reasonable answers are not provided, those asking the questions become unhappy. For all these reasons, now is the perfect time to talk to a philosopher to get positive answers to these questions and hold onto life.
Having questions about life does not mean you have a spiritual problem. If you had a cancer or heart problem, we would never ask, "Should I see a doctor?" We would go to the nearest health center, sometimes even to the emergency room, and ask for help. Philosophical Counseling invites you to reflect deeply on your life.
Finally, can you say that you have achieved satisfying results?
So far, those who have come and spoken with me are very satisfied. According to the data from the American Philosophical Practitioners Association, no one has ended their life after speaking with a philosopher. Yet, the problem for most of those who come to us is related to the meaning of life. So far, four people have stated that they gave up on suicide after speaking with me. This is very, very important to me. We still have many people we need to reach.
They say life is meaningless and they don't want to live. However, speaking with a philosopher can reconnect you to life.